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Is the Ring View backwards?

I have used Segment Pro for a while and I do use the Ring view for some of the more complicated designs. I started a bowl today and discovered (I think) that the Ring view seems to be exactly opposite the Bowl view. If you look at the bottom row (#2) of segments look and the species on each side of the two Maple segments. In the bowl view the segment to the right of the Maple is Cherry, while in the Ring view it is Bubinga. I don't guess this will make a huge difference in the final design, but it will be the opposite of what I designed. Or am I crazy?
 

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I think you are right. I would suggest sending Lloyd an email and ask him about the ring view vs bowl view.

I recreated your ring 2 in a bowl and the maple, yellowheart and walnut.
Yellow heart in 1, 3, 5, etc.
Walnut in 2,4,6, etc.
maple in 7,8 etc.

bowl view yellowheart on the right, walnut on the left
ring view, walnut on the right and yellow heart on the left.

Will be interesting to see what Lloyd has to say.
 
If you believe it is backwards then it is backwards. Both the Bowl View and Ring View are purchased controls and I shove the data to the controls exactly the same way. One obviously works backwards from the other and I simply never noticed it.

I’ll take a look at it. I won’t touch the bowl view because I’m much more likely to break it. There may be a setting to the Ring View control on which direction it should go. I’ll fix it and make it part of the next upgrade. I’m working on one now but it has a lot of complicated things in it and some of them are kicking my butt. I hope to have it out this month.

Lloyd
 
Thanks. I think this is the first time I noticed it because this bowl design is asymmetrical, where others are symmetrical. Not a big problem, but probably good to fix when you can.
 
Just a note that might be worth considering. If you build a bowl upside down like you would if you are using Segeasy Plates and the Stomper the Ring View is correct. If you are building a bowl from the bottom up like you would on a Chefware EZ segment jig or other platform it is backwards. If it possible you may want to make this something you can toggle depending on how you build your bowls. I just started building my second open segment bowl using a platform instead of a plate and noticed the Ring View didn't make sense to me either. I recently completed my first open segmented bowl using a Segeasy type of plate and the Ring View made perfect sense.
 
I have confirmed what Don has said in that if you build the bowl using a Stomper/SegEasy plate and lay the segments out as shown in the PDF file, it builds the bowl that is shown in the Bowl View - you're just building it upside down. If you use an indexing solution, though, it is far simpler because you are building the bowl right-side up.

If using an indexing solution, lay the segments out as shown in the Bowl View or the Paint Screen. This will be rotating the rings in the opposite direction from the Stomper approach, but it will be obvious that you will need to do this to match the design.

This does not require additional user interface or additional options since the Ring View is already correct if using the Stomper and the layout rotation is obvious if you're indexing - just rotate the Ring View to match the design.

Lloyd
 
I have confirmed what Don has said in that if you build the bowl using a Stomper/SegEasy plate and lay the segments out as shown in the PDF file, it builds the bowl that is shown in the Bowl View - you're just building it upside down. If you use an indexing solution, though, it is far simpler because you are building the bowl right-side up.

If using an indexing solution, lay the segments out as shown in the Bowl View or the Paint Screen. This will be rotating the rings in the opposite direction from the Stomper approach, but it will be obvious that you will need to do this to match the design.

This does not require additional user interface or additional options since the Ring View is already correct if using the Stomper and the layout rotation is obvious if you're indexing - just rotate the Ring View to match the design.
Lloyd
Would it be possible to add a print function to the Paint view. I don't have a computer in my shop as I'm sure many of us don't. It would be nice to be able to take a printed image of either the Paint Screen or the Rings .pdf to work off of depending on the assembly method being used. I happen to do it both with Segeasy method and Platform method. It is really inconvenient to have to go back and forth from the house to the shop trying to make sure I get my segmented vessels assembled properly.
 
Would it be possible to add a print function to the Paint view. I don't have a computer in my shop as I'm sure many of us don't. It would be nice to be able to take a printed image of either the Paint Screen or the Rings .pdf to work off of depending on the assembly method being used. I happen to do it both with Segeasy method and Platform method. It is really inconvenient to have to go back and forth from the house to the shop trying to make sure I get my segmented vessels assembled properly.
Here is a link to an older thread that discusses printing the paint view

It is pretty simple to print the paint view in SP using Microsoft Paint or a 3d party graphics program.
- hold down the windows button on your keyboard and press PrtSc.
Windows will capture the screen and place in the the screenshot folder on your PC
Clicking on the saved image will load it into Paint.
From there you can print the image.
 
Here is a link to an older thread that discusses printing the paint view

It is pretty simple to print the paint view in SP using Microsoft Paint or a 3d party graphics program.
- hold down the windows button on your keyboard and press PrtSc.
Windows will capture the screen and place in the the screenshot folder on your PC
Clicking on the saved image will load it into Paint.
From there you can print the image.
You would think that an application would have the necessary features without having workarounds to get the job done!
 
You would think that an application would have the necessary features without having workarounds to get the job done!
That is what the ring view is for. It creates a pdf file containing each ring layout.

I do not believe any software has to have each view or screen be made printable within the software. The information from the ring view file is the same as you would get from the paint view screen.

Sorry you find it an inconvenience to push a few keyboard buttons and use the Paint program provided by Microsoft or other graphic program.
SP is what it is. A very good segment planning tool.
 
That is what the ring view is for. It creates a pdf file containing each ring layout.

I do not believe any software has to have each view or screen be made printable within the software. The information from the ring view file is the same as you would get from the paint view screen.

Sorry you find it an inconvenience to push a few keyboard buttons and use the Paint program provided by Microsoft or other graphic program.
SP is what it is. A very good segment planning tool.
My comment about the application not having the necessary features comes from two points that have come up in this thread. First, when someone thought the ring view was backward, which it is if you use a platform to assemble your project I suggested that a toggle function be added to the application to change the ring view to accommodate both types of users. Instead we were given a workaround of using the paint screen. Second, since using the paint screen was a work around for not having the ability to swap the ring view which can be printed you get another work around to the original work around to be able to print the paint screen. My points are just suggestions to make a good product even better. I have done some software development myself and I know that many suggestions made by the people using the software are a good place to find worthwhile improvements. MFisher, I wasn't looking for a snarky reply. I can live with the workarounds but as a person paying good money for a piece of software I shouldn't have to. Since work arounds are your answer to problems for users here is another one. I purchased the last full version of Adobe Acrobat. I say the last full version because all future versions are subscriptions. I think it was on sale for 23.99$. It has the ability to flip the rings in the ring view pdf to work for me when using my platform to assemble rings. Sorry if this is long but I think MFisher's response is no way to respond to customers comments or complaints.
 
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My comment about the application not having the necessary features comes from two points that have come up in this thread. First, when someone thought the ring view was backward, which it is if you use a platform to assemble your project I suggested that a toggle function be added to the application to change the ring view to accommodate both types of users. Instead we were given a workaround of using the paint screen. Second, since using the paint screen was a work around for not having the ability to swap the ring view which can be printed you get another work around to the original work around to be able to print the paint screen. My points are just suggestions to make a good product even better. I have done some software development myself and I know that many suggestions made by the people using the software are a good place to find worthwhile improvements. MFisher, I wasn't looking for a snarky reply. I can live with the workarounds but as a person paying good money for a piece of software I shouldn't have to. Since work arounds are your answer to problems for users here is another one. I purchased the last full version of Adobe Acrobat. I say the last full version because all future versions are subscriptions. I think it was on sale for 39$. It has the ability to flip the rings in the ring view pdf to work for me when using my platform to assemble rings. Sorry if this is long but I think MFisher's response is no way to respond to customers comments or complaints.
I apologize if you feel my response was out of line.

For the record I am not part of Lloyd's company. I just help out and monitor the forum. Please do not take what I post is anyway an officlal WTP company position. I was giving my personal opinion regarding the software.

Again, apologize. You have a valid idea for improvement.
 
In the five years that Segment PRO has been on the market, we have never discussed the best and most used feature of the software:

Mike Fisher

He has answered 10 times as many questions on the forum as I have. He is always there when anyone needs help. He knows the software better than anyone and is willing to share is knowledge no matter how much time it takes him. I have offered on many occasions to compensate him and he has turned me down each time. He likes doing this and I could not be more thankful for his help.

There was a time that I added every request for new features in Woodturner PRO. I thought I was doing the right thing by being responsive to customers. Version 2 of both Woodturner PRO and Lamination PRO became bloated and cancerous because there was so much fluff and user interface that the software was nearly unusable. Version 3 added a lot of new functionality, but it also gave me a chance to remove everything that was added and never used and they both became more user friendly and the code easier to maintain.

Your request for linear measurement column is a perfect example of this. Is it worthwhile information? Yes. Will new users see it and understand what it means. Hell no. Is it necessary? Nope. Does it save time? Nope. Is it more accurate? Nope. Does it add to confusion? Yes. It adds a column to an already crowded printout and nobody but you has ever asked for it. You gave me links to five YouTube videos and not one of then used a lineal measurement like you were requesting.

But I spent a lot of time figuring out the trigonometry to arrive at the solution, and went to the shop and used it myself to verify that the calculation was accurate. But somebody has to decide if requests become part of the program and that somebody is me.

My approach to making these decisions is pretty simple. I want the software to do what customers need it to do but not necessarily what they want it to do. It needs to have as little user interface as is necessary. I won’t write code to duplicate functionality that Windows provides to all users. And the most important thing is that new functionality must be something that a majority of users need. In 23 years, your request for a linear measurement is the first request I’ve ever had.

Mike’s first answer to your post about the Paint page was a link to a thread that discussed the Paint page and other screens that are non-printable controls. You obviously didn’t read that post but instead attacked the software. The bottom line is that the best I can do is give a button that does a Print Screen to capture the image but nothing more and you already have a button that does that exact thing.

Here’s what isn’t going to happen. This isn’t Twitter, Facebook, TikTok or any of the sites where that is expected. We’re just not going to do that here. We can have discussions and threads where we help each other with a smile on our face while typing or I’m simply going to shut it down.

I have never had a computer class or a trigonometry class, for that matter. I had to teach myself to program starting at age 50 using youtube and reading books. Programming is difficult for me and gets harder the farther I get from 70. Twenty-three years ago I started writing simple software only for me to make segmenting easier for me. It became clear that others need this help, too, so I decided to make it a hobby business and hired a programmer to write Woodturner PRO and 3D Design Pro. When it came to Lamination PRO, though, contract programmers were so expensive that the only way it would happen was to figure out how to write the software myself. Finally, I spend a year designing Segment PRO and then 14 months of head-down work on writing the software. A good programmer could have done it in half that time. Nevertheless, I’ve helped to make segmenting available to anyone and I’ve had a lot of fun doing it.

Now that I’m retired, I have found that I like golf, music, photography and travel more than I like programming. If the right person comes around, the business is for sale and they can take it to a whole new level. Until then, I like getting suggestions but here is the simple truth:

You bought the software on a particular day with the guarantee that you would never be charged for an upgrade and there would never be a subscription model so your purchase was one-and-done. You were given the right to use the software for 30 days without paying for it so you could decide whether it met your needs or not. That you have expectations of additional things being done to the software just because you want them to be done is simply not realistic.

Thanks again to Mike for all of your efforts through the years and please, please, please don’t let one unhappy person let you think you need to apologize for anything.

Lloyd
 
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In the five years that Segment PRO has been on the market, we have never discussed the best and most used feature of the software:

Mike Fisher

He has answered 10 times as many questions on the forum as I have. He is always there when anyone needs help. He knows the software better than anyone and is willing to share is knowledge no matter how much time it takes him. I have offered on many occasions to compensate him and he has turned me down each time. He likes doing this and I could not be more thankful for his help.

There was a time that I added every request that was made for new features to Woodturner PRO. I thought I was doing the right thing by being responsive. Version 2 of both Woodturner PRO and Lamination PRO became bloated and cancerous because there was so much fluff and user interface that the software was nearly unusable. Version 3 added a lot of new functionality, but it also gave me a chance to remove everything that was added and never used and they both became more user friendly.

Your request for linear measurement column is a perfect example of this. Is it worthwhile information? Yes. Will new users see it and understand what it means. Hell no. Is it necessary? Nope. Does it save time? Nope. Is it more accurate? Nope. Does it add to confusion? Yes. It adds a column to an already crowded printout and almost nobody needs it, wants it or will use it.

But I spent a lot of time figuring out the trigonometry to arrive at the solution, and went to the shop and used it myself to verify that the calculation was accurate. But somebody has to decide if requests become part of the program and that somebody is me.

My approach to making these decisions is pretty simple. I want the software to what customers need it to do but not necessarily what they want it to do. It needs to have as little user interface as is necessary. I won’t write code to duplicate functionality that Windows provides to all users. And the most important thing is that new functionality must be something that a majority of users need. In 23 years, your request for a linear measurement is the first request I’ve ever had.

Mike’s first answer to you was a link to a thread that discussed the Print screen and other screens that are non-printable controls. You obviously didn’t read that post but instead attacked the software.

Here’s what isn’t going to happen. This isn’t Twitter, Facebook, TikTok or any of the sites where that is expected. We’re just not going to do that here. We can have discussions and threads where we help each other with a smile on our face while typing or I’m simply going to shut it down.

I have never had a computer class or a trigonometry class, for that matter. I had to teach myself to program starting at age 50 using youtube and reading books. Programming is difficult for me and gets harder the farther I get from 70. I wrote this software only for me to make segmenting easier for me. It became clear that others need this help, too, so I decided to make it a hobby business and hired a programmer to write Woodturner PRO and 3D Design Pro. When it came to Lamination PRO, though, contract programmers were so expensive that the only way it would happen was to figure out how to write the software myself. Finally, I spend a year designing Segment PRO and then 14 months of head-down work on writing the software. A good programmer could have done it in half that time. Nevertheless, I’ve helped to make segmenting available to anyone and I’ve had a lot of fun doing it.

Now that I’m retired, I have found that I like golf, music, photography and travel more than I like programming. If the right person comes around, the business is for sale and they can take it to a whole new level. Until then, I like getting suggestions but here is the simple truth:

You bought the software on a particular day with the guarantee that you would never be charged for an upgrade and there would never be a subscription model so your purchase was one-and-done. You were given the right to use the software for 30 days without paying for it so you could decide whether it met your needs or not. That you have expectations of additional things being done to the software just because you want them to be done is simply not realistic.

Thanks again to Mike for all of your efforts through the years and please, please, please don’t let one unhappy person let you think you need to apologize for anything.

Lloyd
 
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Good morning Loyd. In response to your reply. The suggestions that I made were out of frustration with things that I ran into using your software. All of the Items as additions or fixes that I suggested were brought up as problems and work arounds were discussed in your forum by other users. I didn't see where any of them asked for a fix. I resolved the problem (for me) with the ring view and the need to print the paint view by purchasing Adobe Acrobat so I could flip the rings in ring view to reverse the order of the segments when using a platform to install segments. If that is a problem for others and that function cannot be added to Segment Pro I suggest they do the same. I mentioned that In my previous post.

I purchased a competitors software before purchasing the Woodturner Pro Suite. It was buggy and crashed frequently. After looking for a better solution I decided to purchase your programs. I applaud the design and function that you have produced.

I feel my comment about Mike Fisher was warranted. He made a belittling comment to me which I took personally. I still feel that was out of line.
You said in your post that it was obvious that I did not read the information at the link that Mike sent me. That is true because the link doesn't work and I couldn't find the information in the forum.

I am not some troll attacking everything that everybody posts in any forum. I am a new user that has found a few frustrating issues. My suggestions are just that, suggestions. You can take them for what you think they are worth.

I am new to segmented turning and am working to improve my skills. I don't like all the tinkering and number crunching involved in older methods of turning design. I prefer the technological solution which you provide. My suggestions are just food for thought. As you said you decide what is added and what isn't.
 
I saw nothing snarky in Mike's reply and want to echo what Lloyd said. Mike is the best feature the software has!
 
Let's discuss the OP topic and questions related to the Sofware and move on.

We know that SP does not have a print function built in to print the
- paint view
- profile window
We have work arounds by using the PrtSC and other Windows trick to do screen captures. Other third party graphic programs can be used to print out the screen capture. One that some of us use Irfanview. A free graphic program.

As far as the ring view vs bowl view. Lloyd has commented on the issue.

Irfanview has the ability to flip images both vertically and horizontally. I believe a horizontal flip would be the same as a mirrored image.

This free online tool
has the horizontal and vertical flip of a pdf for free. Have not tried it to see if it it does do a true mirror image.
 
I want to apologize for my comments. They came out of frustration from what I have run into as a new user. I would like to offer up another solution to the screen print discussion. Windows 10 and 11 have a Snip tool that basically allows you to copy any portion of a screen instead of printing the whole screen and you can print it directly from the Snip tool. To use the tool Press (Windows Key+Shift Key+S) You then select new. Next you select what you want to print by dragging your mouse over the area on the screen. The tool will display what you selected To print from the tool, you have to click the three dots in the upper right corner and select print from the dropdown that comes up. You can pin the app to the taskbar while the program is open by right clicking on the app on the task bar and select Pin to taksbar. I hope you find this useful.
 
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I want to apologize for my comments. They came out of frustration from what I have run into as a new user. I would like to offer up another solution to the screen print discussion. Windows 10 and 11 have a Snip tool that basically allows you to copy any portion of a screen instead of printing the whole screen and you can print it directly from the Snip tool. To use the tool Press (Windows Key+Shift Key+S) You then select new. Next you select what you want to print by dragging your mouse over the area on the screen. The tool will display what you selected To print from the tool, you have to click the three dots in the upper right corner and select print from the dropdown that comes up. You can pin the app to the taskbar while the program is open by right clicking on the app on the task bar and select Pin to taksbar. I hope you find this useful.
Nice tip.
Snip is a tool I have not used.
 
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